Drink Size Poll
For an Americano, would you please tell me briefly what size to-go cups your shop uses for Small, Med and Large, and how many shots for each. Also, do you use the same size and ratios for Lattes?
Here's mine:
Small: 10oz cup, 1 Shot.
Medium: 16oz cup, 2 Shots.
Large: 20oz cup, 3 Shots.
I use the same cup sizes and shot for lattes as for americanos.
Here's mine:
Small: 10oz cup, 1 Shot.
Medium: 16oz cup, 2 Shots.
Large: 20oz cup, 3 Shots.
I use the same cup sizes and shot for lattes as for americanos.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by John on
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Thanks Brady.
My single PF uses about 9 grams. My double PF uses 14 grams (i've weighed them before and did so again today). I use 1 oz to 35 ml, including the crema.
And no, by "shot" I don't mean a double. I mean the same thing you do. For some reason I prefer not to use the single PF. For a single shot, I prefer to use half of the double PF and throw the other have away (into my belly, ususally). Partly because I only have one grinder.
I'm confused about the issue of over- and under-dosing in this and other discussions. Aren't all espresso machines designed so the baskets hold the same dose when the barista levels the coffee in the basket? I have a La Cimbali and a Rancilo and a Rilo and they all hold the same dose (9 and 14). I guess the dose would change slightly by changing the grind, even if you level the portafilter.
My espresso is fairly bold. Recently roasted (2-10 days ago). A blend of Mexican regions. About 50% medium roast and 50% medium-dark.
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Permalink Reply by Al Soto on
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Small: 12 ounce cup: Double shot (2 ounces of espresso)
Med: 16 ounce: 2 double shots (4 ounces of espresso)
I don't do a 20 ounce even though I could. At our shop (which will open soon) we double our espresso shots in all our espresso drinks. 2, 4 & 6 ounces of espresso for lattes, caps etc. Caps are equal parts milk and espresso so we use a 12 ounce cup for a small and large up to 4 ounces of espresso. I may drop to 8 ounces cups if I can find lids for them :)
Al
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Permalink Reply by Josh Melby on
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our small americanos are 12 oz with 2 shots, and sizes increase by four ounces and 1 shot increments. We don't put 3 shots in med. lattes, though. this is probably because we have been located in a mall in south dakota and we get those 35-45 year old wealthy women who order non-fat sugar-free decaf lattes ALL THE TIME and it would just be too tedious to pull four shots but only use three of them. so we go small (2), med (2), and large (4). i wonder if it helps my owners profit or break even or something by not wasting coffee like that.
also, al, we have 8 oz cups for caps. i think the lids are from 'solo' but i can't be certain. i know they're white, though. :p
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Permalink Reply by John P on
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Everything is standard double shot. We do 12 and 16 ounce to go Americano, as well as an off menu 8 oz.
For the most part, I have found that people wanting larger drinks aren't getting it for the espresso. They are welcome to add shots if they would like, and we're happy to pull them.
For me, 6-8 ounce double is perfect.
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John, just o clarify, then, your 12oz has 2 shots, and your 16oz also has 2 shots? Thanks.
John P said:Everything is standard double shot. We do 12 and 16 ounce to go Americano, as well as an off menu 8 oz.
For the most part, I have found that people wanting larger drinks aren't getting it for the espresso. They are welcome to add shots if they would like, and we're happy to pull them.
For me, 6-8 ounce double is perfect.
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Yes. Consistency. We do a fair number of triple and quad shots, but on the larger drinks I'd rather leave it to the customer to decide if they are in it for the espresso. We tend to highlight the smaller drinks, and those who are looking for more espresso, generally get something smaller, or they simply get a shot. We don't do any hot drinks over 16 oz.
John Kijote said:John, just o clarify, then, your 12oz has 2 shots, and your 16oz also has 2 shots? Thanks.
John P said:Everything is standard double shot. We do 12 and 16 ounce to go Americano, as well as an off menu 8 oz.
For the most part, I have found that people wanting larger drinks aren't getting it for the espresso. They are welcome to add shots if they would like, and we're happy to pull them. For me, 6-8 ounce double is perfect.
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I am buying my coffee from DoubleShot Coffee house in Tulsa Oklahoma (they are the ones who were being threatened with a suit by Starbucks if they did not change their name) and they have been very successful with doubling their espresso in their drinks. That is where the DoubleShot name comes from. I also believe that it is not only a better value for the customer, but also a better drink. So my 12 oz latte for example will have a double shot of espresso (2 ounces), the 16oz will have a quad, 4 oz of espresso and so forth. Anyhow, this is the philosophy that I will be following.
Al
John P said:Yes. Consistency. We do a fair number of triple and quad shots, but on the larger drinks I'd rather leave it to the customer to decide if they are in it for the espresso. We tend to highlight the smaller drinks, and those who are looking for more espresso, generally get something smaller, or they simply get a shot. We don't do any hot drinks over 16 oz.
John Kijote said:John, just o clarify, then, your 12oz has 2 shots, and your 16oz also has 2 shots? Thanks.
John P said:Everything is standard double shot. We do 12 and 16 ounce to go Americano, as well as an off menu 8 oz.
For the most part, I have found that people wanting larger drinks aren't getting it for the espresso. They are welcome to add shots if they would like, and we're happy to pull them. For me, 6-8 ounce double is perfect.
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Permalink Reply by The Barista Formerly Known As JavaJ on
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John Kijote said:I really just meant to have a quick poll about how many shots people are using in what size cup, regardless o how many grams or ounces they are, or why.
The vast majority of coffee being made out there is utter and total crap. I really don't know why, it's not like its rocket science, but it's mostly crap. So a quick poll of what other people are doing, doesn't really help you. Keep in mind that this is a public forum, and my answer was targeted at both answering the "soul" of your question, as well as steering the discussion towards a better understanding of modern espresso theory.
But since your replies are so interesting, I'll go with the discussion. One reason I'm interested is because we don't have enough "black coffee" sales to warrant using a drip machine. All "drip" orders are espresso-based.
Lots of stores do this and with great success. One thing to consider is the use of single origin espresso. It can mimic the taste of drip coffee a little better and offer more variety.
Now, maybe I don't understand the concept of an Americano, but I thought it's purpose was to use enough espresso to make the drink tast like an "american-style" drip. In my opinion, and in that of most of my polled customers, one Shot in a 12oz cup is plenty to make it taste like light-roast brewed coffee. 2 Shots in a 12 oz. makes it taste like a dark roast, and it's almost too strong.
Since your question was basically asking how strong an Americano should be, the answer needs to start with an understanding that there is no such thing as a standard shot. We don't know how "strong" your shots are. Nonetheless, one shot sounds incredibly weak. For perspective, even Starbies uses a double in a 12 oz Americano.
And 3 shots in a 16 oz. would be overpowering. I, as a barista & espresso-drinker, enjoy it, but I think most would not. Oh, and 2 shots in an 8 or 10 oz cup could only be appreciated by espresso drinkers ( .03401 % of my customer base).
Perhaps this is true (again) for your coffee. However, I am curious how you know? Are you guessing based on an understanding of your customers? Have you done taste tests? I am not saying that you are wrong, just that in some instances, you may be surprised what your customers like.
I have used 1.5 oz shots because that was the WBC norm when I opened my shop. But I've been doing 1oz shots lately. I personally can taste the difference when I drink straight espresso, but in an Americano, I taste no appreciable difference between the size of the shot, be it Lungo, Regular or Ristretto. I doubt many customers would. I've got to decide on some cost-effective ratios, or I might be out of business.
OTOH, if your customers feel your drinks are "watered down" then you could likewise be out of business. Do what you think is right based on what makes the best drink. Do not apply different standards to what you like and what you think your customers will like. Do what you like, and do it well, and you will find success. And charge appropriately for it, not what "they" are charging.
The Barista Formerly Known As JavaJ said:We don't vary the shots too much from drink to drink.
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Permalink Reply by Joey Trujillo on
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We like 2 shots/8 oz of water. Good rich flavor from the espresso, generally not watered down.
And we prefer to only serve it in that 8 oz size, but make exceptions occassionally. We have an 8 oz house cup for brewed coffee, so that was our reasoning for going for an 8 oz size for Americanos.
12 and 16 oz for lattes, both with 2 shots.
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Permalink Reply by Diane Harris on
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We offer an 8oz, 12oz, 16oz and a 20oz cup in all of our drinks. For anything with milk the ratio is; 8 single, 12 and 16 double and a 20 triple.
For an americano, we sell the cup by the shot. I do this because everyone has their idea of a perfect strength. I dink (and suggest to my customers) a double 8oz, triple 12oz, quad 16oz or 20oz. I get many variations of this, but by figuring the cost by the shot it eliminates the "But I only want 1 shot in that 20oz cup, how much will that cost me" and then trying to do the math at the register. The cup cost is not that much different and really, how much does hot water cost?
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Permalink Reply by Sol Vazquez on
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Small is 10oz. with 1 shots. (each shot 35ml).
Medium is 16 oz. with 2 shots.
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Permalink Reply by JmyWhsprs on
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2,3,4
12 oz.: 2 shots
16 oz.: 3 shots
20 oz.: 4 shots
* this is a time tested formula to cater to the most common of tastes
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