Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Greg Cross on February 29, 2008 at 4:12am

Hey Rich ... thanks for your comments. While using a blogging software like Typepad or Blogger, etc. does minimize costs you do compromise (as you noted) on other online growth potential opportunities - which translated means more money in the pockets of Aldo Coffee Owners - if you're interested in making more money that is - smile!

Perhaps the biggest confirmation you can have regarding your online presenece is not what the gang at Aldo Coffee thinks of their web presence, but what does the patrons or Aldo Coffee Community think of your web presence. Are they 'satisfied' with the information that they are getting and/or able to get via your URL? If they are (and you get feedback/comments regularly that they are) then you are scratching an itch.

However, there is also the 'unknown entity' or 'untargeted customer' for whom you perhaps are not reaching because of the lack of agressive SEO strategies or simply are not scratching their itch. And you do not know about them because simply - they have no clue that you exist.

If I were visiting your fine city (and I had a friend who grew up in Pittsburgh and who is a great ambassador for your city) and wanting to find a coffee shop I would do a Google (the Daddy of search engines) search. In fact, I did do a Google search - I typed in 'coffee shops in Pittsburgh' - this is what I found, but sadly Aldo did not make the list and was not even on the Google landing page for my search ...


Beehive Coffeehouse
- www.beehivebuzz.com - (412) 488-4483 - 3 reviews

Kiva Han
- www.kivahan.com - (412) 687-6355 - 2 reviews

Starbucks Coffee
- www.starbucks.com - (412) 642-9066 - 1 review

Starbucks Coffee
- www.starbucks.com - (412) 281-2380 - 1 review

Shadow Lounge
- www.7thmovement.net - (412) 363-8277 - 4 reviews

Enrico's Tazza D'Oro
- www.tazzadoro.net - (412) 362-3676 - 5 reviews

Nicholas Coffee Co
- www.nicholascoffee.com - (412) 261-4225 - 1 review

Starbucks Coffee
- www.starbucks.com - (412) 621-5792 - 2 reviews

Starbucks Coffee
- www.starbucks.com - (412) 261-4353 - 2 reviews

Starbucks
- www.starbucks.com - (412) 201-2004 - 1 review

So, keep hammering away ... cuz' this is one coffee drinkin' lover who would not have found you guys if I was doing a simple text search. However, now I have no excuse, right? Because of Barista Exchange I now know about the famous Aldo Coffee Co. I'll be sure to stop by if I am ever in the neighborhood.

I have other things to suggest about your site that you could do to leverage more business, but I will stop here and let you or others in this group inquire for more if interested ....

Much Success!!!

Permalink Reply by Rich Westerfield on February 29, 2008 at 7:32am

But Greg, we're not actively going for people just looking for a "coffeehouse in Pittsburgh" or even "coffee in Pittsburgh". We're looking for people who are looking for the "best coffee/cappuccino/espresso/latte/baristas/etc. in Pittsburgh" or any of a couple dozen other search strings that our target audience would Google when looking for a quality focused shop.

That's basic marketing - target to the appropriate audience. As we're not downtown or near a tourist area, we need to be a destination as far a Googlers go so we choose our key strings accordingly.

Someone searching for simply "coffeehouse in Pittsburgh" might very well be delighted with Starbucks. Odds are good they're not even interested in coffee - more likely internet or a meeting place. Someone searching for one of our strings most definitely would not be satisfied with Starbucks.

FWIW, I've been at this a long time. Used to work with Danny Sullivan at Internet World back in the day. I'll add that if you REALLY liked coffee and were heading to Pittsburgh, you wouldn't use Google at all. You'd use EspressoMap as inclusion requires some vetting and peer review. Those people find us - they're the ones who talk and spread the word. And we're pretty good with WOM too.

Permalink Reply by u30jxwipu1i1 on February 29, 2008 at 8:13am

Greg,

I'm confused. You are offering SEO advice and web marketing advice, yet I just visited your own domain and well.......... Hows that website working for you? from .CC to email linkage it seems very 1993. Sorry if I seem out of line, but I really like to see advice offered from those that walk the talk Etc.

Could you explain your strategy?

Terry Z

Permalink Reply by Dave White on February 29, 2008 at 8:42am

Thats weird... I did my own Google search "Pittsburgh Espresso" which is the term I personally would have used and Aldo came up #1. It may not be their choice to use coffeehouse in their promo language, most folks do not use the term coffeehouse and those that do can pay the price of going to Starbucks since they didn't know any better.

I think blogs are excellent ways for a cafe to have a solid presence on the web. Blogs are search engine friendly generally and if you set them up and name them right you are bound to get good Google results.

Salesguy... You may know a little about SEO but do you know anything about forum educate? Your BX profile states you do lots of work for coffee shops. I couldn't find even a mention of coffee on your LinkedIn profile.

http://www.linkedin.com/pub/0/9BA/473

Permalink Reply by Hugh Mooney on February 29, 2008 at 9:32am

Aaron;
Just visited the RayJen site. That is hard to look at, gives me an instant headache.

Hugh

Permalink Reply by Greg Cross on February 29, 2008 at 9:37am

Gentleman:

My intention was not to get into a shouting match over "the more superior way" to get search results. Terry ... you are right - at the moment my website is non existent. I am overhauling my whole site, but did not want to have nothing up there, so for now that will do until my overhaul is done. My strategy is fine. Thanks for checking it out though.

Agreed that blogs can be leveraged to harness internet traffic and community based social traffic. I have no problem with that ... I felt I was conciliatory in those ares where I agreed with Rich. Even through Rich's own confession was that he gave up certain web comforts by going the blog route. Not a problem. SEO, as you guys know, is a TLC endeavor. It is an ever-changing thing. Do you guys not agree with that? Do you not agree that you have to stay on top of your stats, etc. to continue to improve on "getting found."

To show by your own examples you guys are stating that you punched up this search phrase or that search phrase in Google and found what you were looking for. Great! Fantastic! But c'mon guys that doesn't make necessarily for a good case. In my search I arbitrarily punched up 'coffee shops in Pittsburgh.' Which mind you I think is a relevant search phrase. Aldo did not come up for that search. That is all I was saying. The point was NOT intended to put those in this discussion on the defense, but rather the point was that we often can miss customers by not staying on top of the SEO game. There is a subjectivity to search phrases. When doing SEO you are assuming what YOU think someone will use to find your site. And as you guys know, it is more than just keywords ... linkage, etc.

Thanks for the discussion!

Permalink Reply by Hugh Mooney on February 29, 2008 at 9:55am

I just launched a small site a month or so ago using GoDaddy's "quick shopping cart" (PayPal) and website builder - the low end of what they offer. www.TheCoffeeCorral.com
I am totally new to the coffee industry - any comments would be appreciated. I realize there are limitations on what I can do but my first goal is to get some, even if limited, SEO.

My wife is a Realtor dealing with specific properties in a tight geographic area (horse, ranch, estate properties - Lake Mathews, Gavilan Hills, Gavilan Springs - California), I've been maintaing her site for a little over two years - (it's provided by alamode.com) - when you Google! "Lake Mathews (Gavilan Hills or Gavilan Springs) horse property", "Gavilan Hills Real Estate", or similar search words it comes up at or near the top. alamode.com's software provides for adding keywords and SEO. Her site address is www.MaryJoPlacka.com

Permalink Reply by u30jxwipu1i1 on February 29, 2008 at 10:22am

Greg,

No shouting match from me.

Here is how I look at this forum and the content of the discussion. It seems that you offer advice, yet, the process used by your own firm does not conform to the advice you offer.

SEO, is a never ending process, and yes, it changes all the time. It is actually one of the best parts of website maintenance in my opinion, as the challenge is great and has many rewards if the game s played correctly.

Both Dave W, and I have many years of web development experience and have utilized that experience and our love of coffee to develop many websites dedicated to coffee product and culture.

Linkage is the most effective SEO practice at this moment. That does not mean however that if you start requesting linkage that you will see increased traffic. Linkage takes years, literally.

Many find that pay per click is the answer, however as many of us know, (the hard way), pay per click is like giving money to your competition. Years of hard work and detail to attention, and the thing that all web designers require when building a site
" Content, Content Content".

The only reason I point to your site as a problem is that I would never consider offering advice on my particular industry if I did not know it very well. The example you provide does not show much in the way of the opinion you offer.

I also appreciate the discussion.

Terry Z

Permalink Reply by Dave White on February 29, 2008 at 10:24am

Google SEO hasn't changed in years. Quality content, correctly identifying and using keywords in content and just basically following the rules of good titling and tagging gets good Google results. This is not a changing thing other than if you are using unscrupulous search tactics which they (google) tries to eliminate through updates. Couple the honest content and tagging with some quality link backs which is the basis for PR (Page Rank) and you should be tops on Google.

To me it seems like you may have tried all sorts of "Pittsburgh Coffee" searches until you found the one that yielded no Aldo results which seemed to support your angle.

I tried just ONE Google search and Aldo was the #1 result. So all Aldo needs to do is make the addition of Coffee House into their content and possibly a tag or two and I bet you see #1 results using your search in a matter of days.

On your BX profile it says you've been in the Industry for 3 years, which industry? We generally take this to mean the coffee industry here as we are all coffee folk who know each other pretty well, it is a smaller business than you think.

Permalink Reply by u30jxwipu1i1 on February 29, 2008 at 10:33am

Hugh,

A couple of quick thoughts. Alt tag the images and the nav bar. Sweeten up the intro text with coffee and origin content. The story is cute but the robots will only read what is there.

Over all I think you did a fantastic job representing your overall company and the intent of your offerings.

Congrats,

Terry Z

Permalink Reply by Greg Cross on February 29, 2008 at 11:05am

Terry,

I agree.

A little grace/concession is needed here ... my site is being overhauled. I have been working in this industry for many years as well now and have conceded to you that my site at the moment is not a reflection of my expertise. I am quite comfortable offering advice - thanks for yours - I am in agreement.

Permalink Reply by Greg Cross on February 29, 2008 at 11:20am

Hugh,'

Site looks good for your first site!! Adding to what Terry suggested - in case you did not know ... an Alt Tag is when one of your visitors "mouses" (moves their cursor over an image) over an image, a tag or a "dialog box" will pop up providing the user with a short, pithy textual description of what that image is. Does that make sense. Same with the nav bar, but that IMHO is not that crucial and even redundant to me.

Another suggestion - if possible ... I would enlarge your Coffee Corral logo in the upper left hand corner. Show off that brand!!! Smile! You have done a great job using images/themes around the whole "cowboy" motif. Love your tag line!!!

Final suggestion - only cuz I am huge on targeted marketing - I would make your "Register for The Coffee Corral email updates ? pop more by using a graphic or something. Maybe an ole' time
Pony Express Horse or something. Getting people to opt-in and subscribe to information from your business is a sure fire way to sell more product.

A great book that explains more about this is PyroMarketing. Best marketing book I have read in recent years. I live this guys stuff our everyday in my own business and with my clients.

Visit www.pyromarketing.com for more info.
You can download the whole book in an Mp3 format for free.

Much Success!!

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• 2
• 3
• Next ›
• Page