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Permalink Reply by Kevin Ayers on February 6, 2011 at 6:54am

Check out the Alex Duetto, dual boilers with PID on both. No personal experience but sure looks pretty sweet.

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Permalink Reply by Keith Eckert on February 6, 2011 at 8:35am

I was also going to recommend the Duetto as well.  Has an e-61 grouphead, rotary pump, dual broilers, PID, beautiful stainless steal construction...about as close to a production machine you will get that fits nicely at home.  Pair it with a Mazzer mini, you have a very consistent, reproduce-able, test machine.  costs about 4 G's less than the LaMarzocco GS-3.  Now I know the GS-3 is a rocking machine, but is in a different league financially.  

 

The Izzo Alex (heat exchange) with PID is also a very consistent machine and worth every penny.  Better than every other e-61 group machine out there and a bit cheaper than the dual boiler model.

 

Chris as Chriscoffee.com is willing to bargain too, so don't walk away paying list price. 

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Permalink Reply by luke hudek on February 6, 2011 at 1:47pm

thanks for the advice so far, I will inquire more about the Duetto now.  I will also be checking out some Simonelli machines.

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Permalink Reply by Brady on February 7, 2011 at 10:08am

Your small, inexpensive PID'd commercial machine options are limited.  Frankly, your commercial PID'd machine options are kinda limited, period.  Precise temp control is just not a feature that the average cafe is worried about yet.  Good electronic temp control is a little easier to find - Rancilio and several others have gone to that pretty much across the board... but a true PID'd machine?  I think the NS Aurelia Competition model and a couple of recent La Marzoccos are your only options in this area.

 

As far as the rest of the Nuova Simonelli machines, they use traditional pressurestats.  That's not to say that they aren't good machines or don't put out great shots - because they absolutely are and do.  They just aren't PID'd.

 

It might be a little (lot) out of your price range and more machine than you need... but an interesting option is the Astoria +4U.  This machine has individual group brew boilers and water temperature control - so you can have one group at 197.5 and the other at 201.

 

There's not really a recommendation (or many opinions, for that matter) in there... just thought I'd share some thoughts.

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Permalink Reply by luke hudek on February 7, 2011 at 1:04pm

my initial thought was to do this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3N-TREUvAM

 

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Permalink Reply by Brian Bergman on February 7, 2011 at 1:45pm

I'm surprised nobody is mentioning the Marzocco GS/3. Too much $$? As best as I can tell, it's got everything you're asking for, and it's a KILLER machine....especially since it could serve as a back-up in a pinch. Thoughts? http://www.lamarzocco.com/gs3.php

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Permalink Reply by Keith Eckert on February 7, 2011 at 1:49pm

I mentioned the GS-3, but the OP wanted "less costly", the GS-3 is about as expensive as they come, not to mention the manual pressure controll can add another variable to the mix (and if you are taste testing for quality control, the big idea is to remove as many variables as possible, not add more variables). 

 

 

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Permalink Reply by Brian Bergman on February 7, 2011 at 2:41pm

Understood, although with the GS-3 you can set those parameters and know that they'll consistently remain the same until you decide to change them. As the poster stated, "I would like to be able to have a good bit of control on the machine..." and control means variables and variables means big $$, so it's a big circular problem bringing you back to square one...know what I mean?

 

Keith E said:

I mentioned the GS-3, but the OP wanted "less costly", the GS-3 is about as expensive as they come, not to mention the manual pressure controll can add another variable to the mix (and if you are taste testing for quality control, the big idea is to remove as many variables as possible, not add more variables). 

 

 

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Permalink Reply by luke hudek on February 7, 2011 at 4:40pm

I spoke to the people at Chris Coffee (http://www.chriscoffee.com/products/home/espresso/izzoduetto) and found out the Duetto would be within the price range I was looking at and meet our requirements...and to boot its the same machine Intelligentsia uses to test their espresso!

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Permalink Reply by luke hudek on February 7, 2011 at 5:07pm

I looked into this as well but its probably not worth the price for what I am using it for (only a few times a year would it brew in public with it!).

 

I have also looked into other E-61 PID machines like

http://www.wholelattelove.com/Expobar/exbrew_4p.cfm

 

I hope I have not come across as ungrateful btw, the advice you have given thus far has been very helpful...I am anxious to sell off my 2 group (its just overkill atm) and start brewing on a more controlled machine!

CodaCoffee said:

Understood, although with the GS-3 you can set those parameters and know that they'll consistently remain the same until you decide to change them. As the poster stated, "I would like to be able to have a good bit of control on the machine..." and control means variables and variables means big $$, so it's a big circular problem bringing you back to square one...know what I mean?

 

Keith E said:

I mentioned the GS-3, but the OP wanted "less costly", the GS-3 is about as expensive as they come, not to mention the manual pressure controll can add another variable to the mix (and if you are taste testing for quality control, the big idea is to remove as many variables as possible, not add more variables). 

 

 

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Permalink Reply by Brian Bergman on February 7, 2011 at 9:35pm

Glad you got some good answers. You didn't come off as ungrateful at all. You asked for opinions and now you've got a thread full of them, and hopefully it helped you to narrow in on the parameters/machine you needed to get. We're all learning and figuring it out as we go. Hope it goes well for you!

 

luke hudek said:

I looked into this as well but its probably not worth the price for what I am using it for (only a few times a year would it brew in public with it!).

 

I have also looked into other E-61 PID machines like

http://www.wholelattelove.com/Expobar/exbrew_4p.cfm

 

I hope I have not come across as ungrateful btw, the advice you have given thus far has been very helpful...I am anxious to sell off my 2 group (its just overkill atm) and start brewing on a more controlled machine!

CodaCoffee said:

Understood, although with the GS-3 you can set those parameters and know that they'll consistently remain the same until you decide to change them. As the poster stated, "I would like to be able to have a good bit of control on the machine..." and control means variables and variables means big $$, so it's a big circular problem bringing you back to square one...know what I mean?

 

Keith E said:

I mentioned the GS-3, but the OP wanted "less costly", the GS-3 is about as expensive as they come, not to mention the manual pressure controll can add another variable to the mix (and if you are taste testing for quality control, the big idea is to remove as many variables as possible, not add more variables). 

 

 

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Permalink Reply by luke hudek on February 15, 2011 at 9:53am

wanted to update this and say I am looking to get a http://www.wholelattelove.com/Expobar/exbrew_4r.cfm as soon as I sell my 2 group Barlume.

 

This machine seems to have the specs I was looking for and I am now anxious!

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