Steam woes! Is it the tip?
I'm running a 90s Astoria SAE-30 and am recently having the worst trouble managing any semblance of microfoam. Never had a huge problem before — it's not the best, but I've managed. Machine was serviced just days ago, and steam power doesn't seem to have changed at all.
It's never been "easy" to steam with — for example, I used a recent model Appia this week for the first time ever, and had no problem getting great milk in just two or three attempts, much more consistent than on the Astoria. But now it seems nearly impossible for some reason. What I'm getting is either too-puffy "bad cappuccino" milk or just really thin milk; bubbles are always sort of large, and when I've managed to get what looks like microfoam, it is actually just thin crap.
Is it the tip? Or what? Anyone else have this bad Astoria experience?
And if it is the tip — a five-hole, where one hole is in center with four surrounding it — what sort of tip should I try replacing it with?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Brady on
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By any chance did your tech "fix" your boiler water level? This can change your steam quality - a higher level creates a "wetter" steam, which creates a foam that collapses more easily. Call your tech and ask exactly what was done, and if nothing raises a red flag post back and maybe we can figure something out together.
But yes, the tip is a challenge... those machines tend to be rocket-steamers. Forces you to really learn how to control your steam.
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Permalink Reply by Mavin on
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machines that has been serviced tend to operate in a faster rate...in your case it could be an usual thing coz many baristas face the same problem after servicing their machine..yes do check wit the technician again on what exactly has been done. the tip might be an issue but im leaving that at last.
clean machines or serviced machines works better and faster,,,( juz like in the competitions, thats why u see baristas knocking their milk pitchers several times b4 they pour ) try steaming several times ( like let 100 cups pass by ) by that time im sure u will be able to control your steam. if u are still getting the same watery or bubbly milk call ur technician.
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Permalink Reply by R. Justin Shepherd on
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Brady,
I've always had to "control my steam" on my machine much more so than on any other I've been behind. But this is ridiculous. Today I steamed slow, I steamed fast. I went back and forth, I tried the wand, the pitcher, the swirl, the fold at every conceivable angle. And nothing but BAD MILK. I even used two different brands of milk, to make sure.
Anyway. Here's what I'm seeing. The water level does seem higher than I remember it being, but then again I never paid a ton of attention to it before. Pressure seems about right. Also, a pic of the best foam I managed. (Go to second to last page of "latte art" thread for what my average milk usually looks like.. it sure as hell doesn't look like this.)
If it is the boiler level, how do I adjust that?
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Permalink Reply by Shadow on
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Most machines have some sort of water level probe in the boiler (triggers the autofill) that can be moved to change the water level. See the attached pic... look at the probe with the blue wire attached.
The water level for most HX machines is typically around 2/3 full and the sight glass in your pic looks OK to me. Good luck!
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Your water level looks about right, as do your pressures*. The level probe on your machine is on the top of the boiler, just left of center. It looks kinda like the one in the pic that Shadow posted, only without the bend. It is a stainless fitting with a teflon tube sticking out, then a stainless steel probe sticking through that, with a single black wire connected to it. On your machine, that probe should be in as far as it'll go - which means pushed in almost to the point that the flattened end (for wire terminal connection) touches the teflon tube. Pull your lid and see if you can find this, then let us know how much probe is outside of that tube.
It is also possible that your valves or wands had seen some buildup over time that was removed as part of the tech's service - perhaps as a valve rebuild or steamwand cleaning? There is a significant difference between the steaming power of the two wands on our machine - one being really powerful, the other being almost unusable. I attribute this to buildup in the one we use more often (which over time has become the more powerful of the two). Not sure what to suggest if this is the case. Next time I talk with the Astoria guys, I'll double check the availability of a different tip.
BTW, I just re-read last night's post, and sorry if it read like I was suggesting that YOU had a steam control problem. What I was trying to say was that the crazy steaming power of that machine forces those of us that use it to develop really good at steam control... kinda like you said.
*OT side note: Actually, your boiler pressure seems a little high - are your brew water temps ok? Perhaps yours is different, but on our Argenta, 1.2 translates to 205+ at the group. I like to see ours running more 1.0-1.1. How's it taste?
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It tastes good to me, especially since I have adjusted my dosing and tamping techniques in recent weeks. That said, I'm not entirely certain I've had what you guys might call a "great" espresso. Subjective, and remember I'm in a sort of isolation from any proper coffee culture.
In any case, say I want to adjust the pressure, how's this done? I'm about to check the probe thing you guys have already mentioned, but I'm assuming at this point that the issue is related to the maintenance, especially since all my baristas have been complaining about it.
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Permalink Reply by Jeremy Gray on
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The pressure stat is in the back left of the machine, well that's where it is on my SAE-2. You can access it from taking the top grate off. Or take the left side panel off and you'll see it. On top of the stat is a screw that holds the cover on and some have a hole with a yellow plug in it(if it's there) inside of that hole is a flat head screw that you can turn to adjust the pressure. If there isn't a hole then you have to remove the cover to adjust it. There is a + or - sign on it to know which way to turn it.
One other thing I thought of. Have you checked those stupid little o ring's inside the tip? It might be part of the problem. I'm not saying it is, just a thought.
What exactly did the maintenance entail?
I'm wondering about different tips as well, especially with espressoparts.com's new Foam Knife Tip. As far as I can tell those new tips won't fit these machines, bummer. They do have an after market 4 hole tip, which might help control the fast steaming that these machines have. Something I might have to give a try.
R. Justin Shepherd said:It tastes good to me, especially since I have adjusted my dosing and tamping techniques in recent weeks. That said, I'm not entirely certain I've had what you guys might call a "great" espresso. Subjective, and remember I'm in a sort of isolation from any proper coffee culture.
In any case, say I want to adjust the pressure, how's this done? I'm about to check the probe thing you guys have already mentioned, but I'm assuming at this point that the issue is related to the maintenance, especially since all my baristas have been complaining about it.
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I replaced those O-rings before, with the rubber bands I'd used 15 years ago for my braces. :-) But the tech didn't take the steam wand apart, so I don't think that's the culprit. And he didn't mess with the left side of the machine either, so I don't think he adjusted the pressure. Hell, I really just need to call the dude.
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Is it normal that when you first turn the boiler pressure down, it goes up a little first?
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Is it normal that when you first turn the boiler pressure down, it goes up a little first?
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Update: I got the boiler pressure down, Brady. Spro tastes a bit brighter, doesn't seem to affect the steam much though. The boiler level probe was all the way in.
So what now? I managed one great latte, in about 15 tries, with the left wand (which I usually don't use and which seems a lot less powerful). My question now is, should I try taking the water level down? If so, how? Or is there a way to adjust the steam wand valves to give more variation on steam power?
I love coffee; I kinda hate (old) coffee equipment.
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