Guy or girl barista?
Hey guys!
Okay, so this one is might be a bit contraversial but we'll see where it goes.
I was talking to some of my staff & a couple of other friends of mine who are in the trade the other day and we got onto the topic of "which sex is best", the usual banter rolls around but then we did get into a fairly deep conversion throwing in various pro's and con's to have male or female baristas. (girls rock btw...hehe).
Things like sex appeal, confidence and even work ethics came about and it was a nice thing to think about after the comedy value was fulfilled...lol
I'd just like to ask you guys what you think. I know that i'm good at what i do, and so are all the ladies i've worked with. But i hire and work with gents who are amazing at what they do too. Also, do you think its a guy trade or a girl trade - i notice on my FB account there are a huge amount of guy baristas???
Opinons guys & gals?...hehe
Kim xx
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Oscar Nyman on
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Kim, is it really sexism you want to discuss in this thread? To me you started of the thread in a sexist and non serious way by saying "girls rock BTW..he he". now you imply that there are gender issues in "less developed countries"? To me the barista/cafe industry is probably the least problematic when it comes to gender and sexism? there should be no, and I have never witnessed any serious sexism, either in the US or any of the less developed countries that I have lived in our travelled to.
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Permalink Reply by Laura Campbell on
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I do think that people who are attractive are more often hired than non-attractive people. It's not necessarily an issue of gender, and I don't think that people who love their coffee base their hires on looks (rather on the barista's ability). But for people who just want to make money...well, sadly, attractive staff can bring in more customers.
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Permalink Reply by Brady on
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Sex may sell, but there is a cost. This thread is fascinating when read along with some of the posts here.
I think many of us would rather work in an environment that was free from awkward and inappropriate customer exchanges. Good customers and good employees are both too valuable to lose when someone takes things one step too far.
Be careful what you wish for...
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Permalink Reply by Deferio on
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addressing the term "sex sells"
If you don't have good coffee then you have to rely on other means to trick people into giving you their money.
If you think that the sex of your barista is a major issue to the success of your shop then your head is in the wrong place to begin with.
And that is why taking this question seriously (other than simply dismissing it as missing the point entirely) is an exercise in futility.
I would like to see a thread instead take the tone of how a manager or a barista can work with different types of individuals in harmony and with respect to the persons unique qualities. I do see basic differences in male and female employees and how those differences are handled (for example: How to graciously address dress code standards with guys vs. girls)
If we hope to grow as professionals then we need to find how to work with and draw out the best in everyone and not posit questions that present or suggest a false dichotomy of choosing between one or the other.
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Permalink Reply by Chris on
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Deferio said:How to graciously address dress code standards with guys vs. girls)
There should be a difference between standards of dress between males and females behind the bar?
It's simple. Barista at one end of the scale, hooker at the other end. Where on the scale do you want your customers to meet your staff?
OTOH, the creepy comments made at your female baristi are part of the human experience, not a problem with your customers. Females are &*not* the risk-takers in msot societies, therefor it is up to the makes to make the advances, and they do it where they find attractive prospective mates. Sociology 101.
Oh, and the difference between appropriate and creepy hinges on whether the recipient thinks he's dreamy, more often than not.
The single most effective way t terminate that line of approach is a polite, friendly, 'No, thank you'. If the recipient (man or woman) can indicate that the answer is no, but that they recognsie that the question was brought on by a flattering appreciation of the persons desirable qualities, a friendly understanding can be reached.
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There is no different standard of dress code but when you as a man are dealing with a woman use some tact when addressing the application of those standards especially when violated. I often would get a female member of management to enforce a dress code when violated. But if that option is not there then just to being gracious and tactful can go far and must be taken into account.
Your comment about creepy things said to female staff being a part of the human experience...is in itself creepy.
Firstly: there is something definitely wrong with someone who thinks saying inappropriate things is right, Secondly:My rule is this...
If a man makes a creepy comment to one of my female staff then I will sit him down, tell him to never come back, and that if he does come back I will call the police for sexual harassment.
Now just think of all the "human experience" in that one. I have only done this once and will not hesitate to do it again.
Chris said:
Deferio said:How to graciously address dress code standards with guys vs. girls)
There should be a difference between standards of dress between males and females behind the bar?
It's simple. Barista at one end of the scale, hooker at the other end. Where on the scale do you want your customers to meet your staff?
OTOH, the creepy comments made at your female baristi are part of the human experience, not a problem with your customers. Females are &*not* the risk-takers in msot societies, therefor it is up to the makes to make the advances, and they do it where they find attractive prospective mates. Sociology 101.
Oh, and the difference between appropriate and creepy hinges on whether the recipient thinks he's dreamy, more often than not.
The single most effective way t terminate that line of approach is a polite, friendly, 'No, thank you'. If the recipient (man or woman) can indicate that the answer is no, but that they recognsie that the question was brought on by a flattering appreciation of the persons desirable qualities, a friendly understanding can be reached.
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Permalink Reply by Brendan on
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While in theory in a perfect world I would completely agree with Chris. I have to say that the world is a huge place! After living in Europe for many many years and in El Salvador and Guatemala for a few Deferio is correct that socially in most of the world males are the aggressors when it comes to asking girls out etc "perhaps acting creepy". Try travelling in Italy as a blonde girl!!!!:) I am not saying that makes all creepy interactions ok, I am just saying that how MOST of the planet interacts with the opposite sex may be very different from Indiana. And i can say from growing up in Bed Stuyvesant Brooklyn that sitting down with a customer and discussing his/her inappropriate semantics with my baristi is not only inappropriate but a good way to get shot!:) But as a manager I have been strangled by a customer who was disrespecting one of my baristi so we all stick out our necks out from time to time don't we?
Deferio said:There is no different standard of dress code but when you as a man are dealing with a woman use some tact when addressing the application of those standards especially when violated. I often would get a female member of management to enforce a dress code when violated. But if that option is not there then just to being gracious and tactful can go far and must be taken into account.
Your comment about creepy things said to female staff being a part of the human experience...is in itself creepy.
Firstly: there is something definitely wrong with someone who thinks saying inappropriate things is right, Secondly:My rule is this...
If a man makes a creepy comment to one of my female staff then I will sit him down, tell him to never come back, and that if he does come back I will call the police for sexual harassment.
Now just think of all the "human experience" in that one. I have only done this once and will not hesitate to do it again.
Chris said:
Deferio said:How to graciously address dress code standards with guys vs. girls)
There should be a difference between standards of dress between males and females behind the bar?
It's simple. Barista at one end of the scale, hooker at the other end. Where on the scale do you want your customers to meet your staff?
OTOH, the creepy comments made at your female baristi are part of the human experience, not a problem with your customers. Females are &*not* the risk-takers in msot societies, therefor it is up to the makes to make the advances, and they do it where they find attractive prospective mates. Sociology 101.
Oh, and the difference between appropriate and creepy hinges on whether the recipient thinks he's dreamy, more often than not.
The single most effective way t terminate that line of approach is a polite, friendly, 'No, thank you'. If the recipient (man or woman) can indicate that the answer is no, but that they recognsie that the question was brought on by a flattering appreciation of the persons desirable qualities, a friendly understanding can be reached.
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Yes we do
Brendan said:While in theory in a perfect world I would completely agree with Chris. I have to say that the world is a huge place! After living in Europe for many many years and in El Salvador and Guatemala for a few Deferio is correct that socially in most of the world males are the aggressors when it comes to asking girls out etc "perhaps acting creepy". Try travelling in Italy as a blonde girl!!!!:) I am not saying that makes all creepy interactions ok, I am just saying that how MOST of the planet interacts with the opposite sex may be very different from Indiana. And i can say from growing up in Bed Stuyvesant Brooklyn that sitting down with a customer and discussing his/her inappropriate semantics with my baristi is not only inappropriate but a good way to get shot!:) But as a manager I have been strangled by a customer who was disrespecting one of my baristi so we all stick out our necks out from time to time don't we?
Deferio said:There is no different standard of dress code but when you as a man are dealing with a woman use some tact when addressing the application of those standards especially when violated. I often would get a female member of management to enforce a dress code when violated. But if that option is not there then just to being gracious and tactful can go far and must be taken into account.
Your comment about creepy things said to female staff being a part of the human experience...is in itself creepy.
Firstly: there is something definitely wrong with someone who thinks saying inappropriate things is right, Secondly:My rule is this...
If a man makes a creepy comment to one of my female staff then I will sit him down, tell him to never come back, and that if he does come back I will call the police for sexual harassment.
Now just think of all the "human experience" in that one. I have only done this once and will not hesitate to do it again.
Chris said:
Deferio said:How to graciously address dress code standards with guys vs. girls)
There should be a difference between standards of dress between males and females behind the bar?
It's simple. Barista at one end of the scale, hooker at the other end. Where on the scale do you want your customers to meet your staff?
OTOH, the creepy comments made at your female baristi are part of the human experience, not a problem with your customers. Females are &*not* the risk-takers in msot societies, therefor it is up to the makes to make the advances, and they do it where they find attractive prospective mates. Sociology 101.
Oh, and the difference between appropriate and creepy hinges on whether the recipient thinks he's dreamy, more often than not.
The single most effective way t terminate that line of approach is a polite, friendly, 'No, thank you'. If the recipient (man or woman) can indicate that the answer is no, but that they recognsie that the question was brought on by a flattering appreciation of the persons desirable qualities, a friendly understanding can be reached.
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Permalink Reply by John P on
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Honestly,
The fact that this question needs to be asked and that the resulting intelligent answers need to be questioned shows why so many small businesses fail.
Common sense is a rarity.
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Permalink Reply by John Gibbons on
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I don't wanna be the downer...but from my perspective...irrelevant. I don't understand the importance. But why is this under Origin and travel?
For a completely other side of this, haha, doesn't matter to me. I'm a guy, and it all comes down to how they treat me. My favorite place has a very...oddly balanced crew. They all treat me well, haha so I guess I depends on those guys and gals who are easily captured by the beauty of the opposite sex.
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Permalink Reply by Julian Hernandez on
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Where I work its 7 girls to 3 guys. I believe in equality, but there is one thing we aren't touching on here. Girls carry many female-specific germs that react poorly with espresso. I once saw three customers come down with violent convulsions and hives from an encounter with a "Girlatte", as I have come to call the volatile liquids. It just needs to be said that once you see a man's eyeballs melt from his head from "Girlatte" poisoning you are never the same. That being said, our shop isn't doing so well.....
oh, and girls make more tips than me.
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Permalink Reply by Jason Haeger on
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Julian Hernandez said:
Where I work its 7 girls to 3 guys. I believe in equality, but there is one thing we aren't touching on here. Girls carry many female-specific germs that react poorly with espresso. I once saw three customers come down with violent convulsions and hives from an encounter with a "Girlatte", as I have come to call the volatile liquids. It just needs to be said that once you see a man's eyeballs melt from his head from "Girlatte" poisoning you are never the same. That being said, our shop isn't doing so well.....
oh, and girls make more tips than me.
I think those are known as cooties. I think most people develop a natural immunity as they mature.
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