Brewed coffee, whazat mean?
Pet peeve of mine is people referring to brewed coffee thinking it's synonymous with drip brewed only. Guess what, if the coffee is hit by water by any brewing method it's brewed coffee. I don't care if it's espresso (yes, espresso extraction is a brewing method), auto-drip, manual pour over, press pot, Aeropress, ibrik, vacuum brewer, vacuum balance brewer, Clover, moka pot, toddy, choreador (Costa Rica peasant coffee sock:-) it's all brewed coffee. Now if the beans are still dry and you just chew it that's another matter, unless you count saliva brewed which I don't count considering brewing methods to be prior to hitting my mouth...
If you wanna be considered a coffee professional, don't use layman misinformed misquided terminology.
Don't get me going on espresso not being coffee... Granted and agreed when someone walks up asks for a cup of coffee they're not (usually) referring to espresso extracted coffee, at least not in the US. Does not negate espresso being coffee.
If you wanna be considered a coffee professional, don't use layman misinformed misquided terminology.
Don't get me going on espresso not being coffee... Granted and agreed when someone walks up asks for a cup of coffee they're not (usually) referring to espresso extracted coffee, at least not in the US. Does not negate espresso being coffee.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Erik Fenstermacher on
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Knowledge is Power!
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Permalink Reply by Jesse -D-> on
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drip doesn't work either. They all drip. What do you call it? You made an argument but presented no solution. Not that I disagree with the point.
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Permalink Reply by Mike McGinness on
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Not sure I'd agree all brewing methods drip. I suppose for example as pouring an ibrik brewed into demitasse cup the last of it may drip out of the ibrik, but that's not part of the brewing. Drip brewing refers to how the water is applied to the ground coffee, dripping down from above. Though depending on the auto-brewer suppose this isn't technically correct either as some have more of a single steady stream than dispersed shower of drips. But as far as the solution call drip brewed drip or drip brewed, French Press or press pot or press, vacuum brewed or vac', ibrik or Turkish brewed etc.
Jesse -D-> said:drip doesn't work either. They all drip. What do you call it? You made an argument but presented no solution. Not that I disagree with the point.
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Permalink Reply by Al Sterling on
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Mike...... you've opened a can of worms.... at least for anyone who values accurate communications.
In addition to your initial pet-peeve, and if you research the internet, you'll find that there is a constant intermingling of brewing methods with the names and types of equipment, and even cultural references. To be more specific, a brewing method, in my opinion, should represent how the components, (coffee and water), are prepared and joined. For example, in Brasil it's common to bring water to a boil in a small stove top container, add sugar, take off boil, add finely ground coffee, stir, steep for a few seconds, then pour through a filter, (coador...that cotton sock affair you know of in Costa Rica), into a carafe or serving device. Some call that "Turkish" coffee. Which again, isn't really specific to how it's brewed, but more referring to the culture, and how they brew their coffee. It mingles culture, and sometimes equipment. And you're right about drip brewing. "Pour-over" and "Percolator" can be very different, but both are, in some sense, referring to water being poured or dripped over grounds that are contained in a filtering device. In this case, as we know, it's more about how the water is brought to boil and then poured over the grounds. And beyond that, it's about the speed and consistency of the pour. "Pour-over" as I know it refers to a constant stream, manual pouring of the water through grounds contained in a filtering device.
Although we don't see them much any more, the traditional stove-top percolator pot on the stove represents a very unique use of the laws of physics to brew coffee. But should it stand alone as "percolator brewed", or some sub-form of dripping water over the grounds?
While I know this won't help the bottom line at the retail level, I believe it's a worthy discussion to "get it straight" for clear communications and training purposes. I would, as I've mentioned, prefer to see the actual method of brewing the coffee not mingled with equipment terms. Those shortcuts, as you originally pointed out, can easily become too much the shortcut and so general that they become ambiguous.
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hmmmm.. this is certainly worthy of discussion. I don't really see an answer though. The way that I am looking at it right now is that: neither "brewed" or "drip" are good enough descriptors. "Brewed Drip" or "Drip Brewed" seems to start to clear things up but then I start to contemplate the details of what that includes.......and that has brought me to my new dilemma: What makes pourover any different than "cone Filter Brewed Drip" from a temperature stable machine? (freshness not being a factor)
Anyway it seems as though "Drip Brewers" are becoming more and more obsolete so hopefully we won't have to worry about what to call it, we an just call it pourover and that will be it.
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Permalink Reply by The Village Bean on
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I may have had a few rum and diet pepsi's way too many tonight - but I need to ask...are you high? There's a whole lot of stuff not right in this country but honey, today - that's not one of em'
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That is funny!
I suppose that is why it is a pet peeve, and not a world isssue. This is a pretty funny topic though, and I'm not sure tthat there is a perfect solution.
The Village Bean said:I may have had a few rum and diet pepsi's way too many tonight - but I need to ask...are you high? There's a whole lot of stuff not right in this country but honey, today - that's not one of em'
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Good point......... I can name a few "pet peeves" than have gone on to become major maketing successes. My corporation/employer, like many others, has taken those rather insignificant issues, and turned them into opportunities. One of the major issues in this industry is education. Some believe that through education, the coffee consumer can be developed into a more valuable purchaser of product.
Lest any marketing profession forget the very famous and effective "Where's the beef??!!!" ad campaign that made a little old lady a world famous hamburger promoter. Her pet peeve was "small burgers lost in a large bun." This can certainly, and understandably, appear trivial if you're dealing with a personal life drama. But coming to the forum with ponderous issues, large and small, can sometimes spawn great things.
Jesse -D-> said:That is funny!
I suppose that is why it is a pet peeve, and not a world isssue. This is a pretty funny topic though, and I'm not sure tthat there is a perfect solution.
The Village Bean said:I may have had a few rum and diet pepsi's way too many tonight - but I need to ask...are you high? There's a whole lot of stuff not right in this country but honey, today - that's not one of em'
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well put Al!
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Permalink Reply by Damion A on
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James Hoffmann wrote a blog post and made a presentation to coffee professionals at the UK Coffee Leader Summit in which he made a distinction between espresso and "brewed" coffee. It turns out that "brewed" in this case means french-press-extracted.
He makes some good points but it's clear, based on his poor English usage in general, that he has a lot of work to do if he wants to be articulate about his craft. In this particular post alone he lumps presses together with drip methods, so it's clear that he knows enough to know that using "brewed" in this way is overly general and therefore not useful. Specialty coffee is all about experience and education and the burden of both falls on the barista/roaster/owner's ability to communicate effectively.
Jim's post.
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Damion..... I read the post by James. Thanks much for sharing. His insights into the market are consistent with mine, and I'm sure many others. It's an important reminder to those who jumped into this market recently, to consider where "espresso" came from, and how its fame and the aura of "reverence" was developed through crafty marketing. As in Italy where it's called espresso, countries like Brasil simply call it cafe', and that implies a type of Middle Eastern brewing method; adding grounds, and usually sugar, to water that was brought to boil, and then filtering into a serving carafe. (of course, in some countries they don't filter) But the by-product-point he made, using Italy as the example, is that in some countries or regions, the word for coffee can also imply the brewing method. I also enjoyed his take on pricing of specialty coffee and the expectations of the coffee consumer. For me, there were allot of valid points brought up in his short piece, and frankly, it validated many of my opinions. BTW, one "peeve point" for me, and one he briefly discusses in his blog, is that of "service quality" being as important as "product quality." I've had battles with others who defend a great extraction as being all we should expect from the retailer. I've never met James, but I certainly do agree with his opinions.
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Permalink Reply by James Hoffmann on
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I do apologise if my English came across as poor to you - could you explain exactly where I fell down?
I do consider coffee brewed in a French Press to be brewed coffee, along with drip, syphon, chemex, cona, swiss gold and anything not percolated under pressure. (I am not sure exactly what coffee from a Moka is - it isn't espresso, but some would be uncomfortable with it considered brewed coffee I guess.)
I wanted to talk about brewed coffee in a very general way because I wan't to embrace as many brewing methods as possible, I'd like to see the industry avoid fetishizing another brewer the way it did the Clover (though I worry we're already doing it with vacpots).
I am not entirely sure how my opinion conflicts with your final sentence, in fact they seem to go hand in hand.
Damion A said:James Hoffmann wrote a blog post and made a presentation to coffee professionals at the UK Coffee Leader Summit in which he made a distinction between espresso and "brewed" coffee. It turns out that "brewed" in this case means french-press-extracted.
He makes some good points but it's clear, based on his poor English usage in general, that he has a lot of work to do if he wants to be articulate about his craft. In this particular post alone he lumps presses together with drip methods, so it's clear that he knows enough to know that using "brewed" in this way is overly general and therefore not useful. Specialty coffee is all about experience and education and the burden of both falls on the barista/roaster/owner's ability to communicate effectively.
Jim's post.
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